2012 Jeep JK Tire Selection Dilemma

With all my posts about tires it’s not surprising that I receive mail asking for opinions and advice on tires. A gentleman named Guy from Washington recently asked for my input. Below are his questions and my replies. My review and comments on the 255/85R16 Toyo M/T on my old F-350 will continue.


Howdy, hope you can help me a bit with a tire selection dilemma: 2012 two-door JK, that I use as a daily driver here in Wenatchee, Washington. Also do a couple of road trips every year, 2000 – 3000 miles each. Hunting. Fishing. Some overlanding. Did the 600 mile WABDR this past summer. I’d like to use the same tires all year, snow, rain, heat.

The two-door JK is a nice platform, I was shopping Jeep JKs online just a few days ago, including the two-door models. Sounds like your Jeep sees a nice mix of uses. As much as I’m a tire aficionado who tests and often owns more than one set of tires for a particular platform, there are advantages to picking a set of all-around treads and using them until they’re ready to be replaced.

Very basic Jeep. Manual transmission, 4.10 gears, aftermarket air lockers front & rear. 1.5″ Teraflex leveling kit (springs).

Sounds nicely set-up. There’s much to be said for lower lifts, and I love manual transmissions. Aftermarket selectable air lockers, presumably ARB Air Lockers, are accessories that offer a level of control over traction and wheel rotation that is only available with selectable lockers.

ARB Air Locker and 4.88:1 gears during setup
ARB Air Locker and 4.88:1 gears during setup

I bought a set of used 16×9″ rims and E-rated 265/75/16 BFG AT’s a week or two after I got the Jeep. Killer deal, $1k for five rims and tires. I’ve put another 25,000 miles on those tires, and they’re getting worn. So I need tires soon. I could just replace them with more 265’s, but they’re a little short.

Several years ago the first aftermarket tires I put on my V8 4Runner were 265/75R16. I agree that 265s are a bit short, most are notably smaller than 32-inches tall. Depending on the tire and tread chosen and the actual height, the advantages to stepping up to a 33-inch-tall tire are quite noticeable. Even with a short thirty-three (32.8″) the approximately one-inch in overall diameter will lift your Jeep a solid half-inch, everywhere. The best lift is tire lift.

I like the 255’s, roughly 33×10’s. Nice! But, I’m afraid they won’t work with my 16×9’s.

You are correct, in addition to being too wide according to the tire manufactures, a 9-inch wheel is a poor choice for a 255 tire for our uses, while a 7–8 inch wheel would be prefect. A 9-inch wheel is also wide for a 265, I prefer to run a 265/7x tire on a stock 7–8 inch wheel. I’ve not shopped for Jeep wheels recently, but I’d image there are many high-quality, original equipment, aluminum take-off wheels for sale on Craigslist. I’ve been a huge fan of the 255/85 size since the early 1990s and have been using them steadily on at least one of my four-wheel-drives since 1998.

New Toyo M/T LT265/75R16E being mounted on 2-door 2005 TJ Rubicon Unlimited
New Toyo M/T LT265/75R16E being mounted on 2-door 2005 TJ Rubicon Unlimited

Simple solution is just 285’s, but… I fear that’s an awful lot of tire for a little two-door JK… Maybe ditch the 16×9 wheels? I do like the way they look, but I could swap to a more narrow wheel & tire combo happily.

Surely 285s will work on your 9-inch wheels and that is a simple solution. Tread choices in 285/75R16 are almost endless. However, I’m not a fan of using wheels that are on the wide end of specifications. For 285s I prefer to run a 7.5-inch (the minimum) or 8-inch wheel, both for how the tire fits the wheel and the narrower overall width. I don’t care for tires and wheels that protrude further than necessary. I’ve run a few sets of 285 tires over the past several years out of necessity or a desire to run a particular tread that was not available in a 255, but I’d almost always prefer a 255/8x if I could get what I’m looking for.

Ditching the 9-inch-wide wheels would be my suggestion regardless of what tire you purchase. Choosing wheels that are at least 7.5-inches wide but no wider than 8-inches, will allow you run any of the tire sizes we are discussing here; 265/75R16, 255/85R/16, or 285/75R16.

Toyo M/T tires, new, unmounted, left-to-right: LT265/75R16E, LT255/85R16E, LT285/75R16E
Toyo M/T tires, new, unmounted, left-to-right:
LT265/75R16E, LT255/85R16E, LT285/75R16E

Have four heavy-duty old style tire chains that are a little big on 265’s and fit 285’s real snug.

One old set of tire chains I have fit both 265/75 and 255/85 tires similarly, I believe both tire sizes use the same chains. My chains are too small for 285s.

And of course I haven’t quite made up my mind re tire type either. The AT’s have done surprisingly well, but I find myself looking hard at the Toyo MT’s and Mickey Thompson MT’s. My son runs 33×12.50 Mickey Thompsons – and they’re terrific off-road, but I’m not that impressed with them on pavement.

When I finish telling the story of using the Toyo M/T on my F-350 the rapid wear might surprise a few readers. I’m a fan of Toyo tires, but when I can, I much prefer a tire that will offer less noise and longer wear. Of course tire wear is often specific to the platform, driver, and use.

There are a set of Mickey Thompson MTZ tires sitting in my shop mounted and ready for use on my Tundra, but have only seen about 2,000 miles of travel. I like them, but I’ve preferred the Dick Cepek FC-II treads I’ve been running for most of the Tundra’s miles. The FC-II (replaced by the Fun Country) has less noise, excellent siping, and have been slow to show wear on everything from an F-350 diesel, the Tundra, and a built V8 4Runner. Of course neither the Fun Country nor the Mickey Thompson MTZ tread are available in the 255/85R16 size.

The biggest decision you have to make is tire size. If you chose either a 265/75 or 285/75 your choices are many, both a blessing and a curse. If you decide to try a set of 255/85R16 rubber, then it will be relatively easy because the choices are relatively few.

If the 255 size wins, and you decide you don’t want a loud or faster wearing mud-terrain tire (Maxxis Bighorn, Toyo M/T, or BFG KM2), I’d suggest you consider a set of Cooper S/T MAXX. The S/T MAXX has only been manufactured in the 255/85R16 size since the first quarter of 2014. I’m currently running a set in the 255/80R17 size on my 4Runner.

Copyright © 2014 James Langan/PhotoWrite Intl.

Wheels, Tires, and Sidewalls

On or off-highway this is a ridiculous wheel & tire combination.

A thread on the expeditionportal.com prompted this post. A gentleman asked how much sidewall is enough as he’s planning to use 37-inch tires on 20-inch wheels on a full-size diesel pickup. He asked if it would be worth it to spend money on 17-inch wheels and tires for occasional, recreational use, while using his twenties for daily driving. My answer to his question was no, it’s probably not worth it just for vacations. Though for me, it would be very desirable to run 17-inch tires & wheels everyday. His questions spurred me to expound on this important subject as it relates to overland travel for the first time here on RoadTraveler.net.

A Sidewall Baseline For 4WDs

I’m not an advocate of tall wheels if they are not necessary, of course many trucks these days have a minimum wheel diameter of 17-inches because the brakes are so large, and wheels between 18–20 inches have become fashionable. A tall wheel simply means less tire sidewall with which to perform off-highway duties for a given tire diameter. Taller sidewalls help a truck ride above the rocks and obstacles, all of the truck, including the wheels. Low-profile tires are needlessly vulnerable to trail damage, offer less flex, and are generally less versatile. It’s often forgotten, misunderstood, or unappreciated that tires are part of a vehicle’s suspension.

Using a 16-inch wheel with a 33-inch tire offers a sidewall height of 8.5-inches, (33 –16)/2 = 8.5″, a good baseline. We could get more technical and use the static radius, but it’s easier to simply use the manufacturers’ stated diameter, and it’s close enough for this topic. The lower half is what we drive on, what matters, and it provides more or less flex depending on its height and design. Sidewall flex can be a positive or a negative depending on your truck, the terrain, and your needs and preferences. In theory, a 35-inch tire on an 18-inch wheel, a 37-inch tire on a 20-inch wheel, as well as my thirty-three on a sixteen example, all have a lower sidewall height of approx. 8.5-inches.

If we are interested in the clearance we get from a particular tire size, specific tires need to be researched using the manufacturer’s data to determine the true diameter. Some tires will be very close to their stated height, 35-inches for example, while some are a half-inch short. One half-inch less diameter means 1/4-inch less sidewall on the bottom, a difference that can easily be measured and felt depending on the sensitivity of your butt dyno.

Load Range and Tire Construction 

A taller, higher aspect ratio, more flexible sidewall is helpful for off-highway travel for both ride quality and traction. One exception being that a stiffer (and tall) sidewall may be more resistant to puncture. A shorter and/or stiffer sidewall is generally less desirable off-highway. For heavy hauling and towing, a shorter, stiffer sidewall can be helpful, as less movement and flex generates less heat. However, on several occasions I’ve successfully and safely used relatively flexible, load-range D light-truck tires with 2-ply sidewalls to haul a couple tons (didn’t exceed tire capacity or GAWR), and have also towed several tons. I’ve also traveled many hundreds of miles (if not thousands) off-highway over the last two decades, mostly on load-range D tires. Have I had sidewall cuts? Of course, but only two that immediately come to mind, and one was last year. If you are concerned about sidewall punctures, there are some excellent, flexible load-range D tires with 3-ply sidewalls in some popular sizes. Your application and performance bias will help you choose your tires. There are many excellent, heavy-duty tires to choose from these days, some in load-range C, D, and E.

I acknowledge that load-range D tires are probably a dying breed, the writing has been on the sidewall for a while. The proliferation of heavy-duty pickups, particularly diesels, over the last several years has greatly influenced the tire aftermarket. Unfortunately even half-ton trucks and lightweight Jeeps are sometimes needlessly sold with load-range E tires, my 2005 Jeep Rubicon and 2011 Tundra are perfect examples. My coil-sprung, 103-inch wheelbase, 2005 Unlimited was a nice riding Jeep, with the exception of the needlessly stiff Goodyear Wrangler MT/R in a 245/75R16E (a relatively short sidewall). I liked the way the Jeep rode with only 25-PSI in the tires. After changing to taller load-range D tires, the combination of a taller sidewall and load-range D made the Jeep ride and perform better at all pressures, on- and off-highway.

My point is that as with many things these days, it’s easy to needlessly go to extremes and forget balance. All-steel, load-range F or G, Michelin military tires are not the best choice for your 3,000-pound soft-top YJ Wrangler, or for your heavy-duty pickup.

Not all load-range E tires are created equal, some are designed to flex better than others when pressures are reduced. My experience with both the BF Goodrich KM2 and All-Terrain T/A in load-range E indicates these tires are not overly stiff and flex well.

265/75R16E front , 255/85R16D rear. The sidewall difference is clear.

Tire Testing

I recently tested two sets of 33-inch tires, both the same size with reasonable 70% aspect ratios, on the same OE wheels, but with different load ratings and sidewall construction. This latest trial simply reinforced the potential differences in ride quality and overall performance between some tires with different load ranges, sidewall designs, or heights. The difference was enough that I was comfortable running considerably more PSI in the lighter, more flexible tire, but wanted to run minimal PSI in the much firmer tire to improve daily-driving ride quality, just like with the Jeep example above. Increasing PSI on a flexible tire will reduce flex and help it run cooler on-highway if desired.

One advantage to more flexible tires is there’s often less need to reduce pressures as much off-highway as with a stiffer tire. Tires that flex, conform, and ride better at a given pressure, and are sometimes so pleasant that for short drives on easy dirt roads with few rocks, there may be no need or desire to immediately lower pressures. Conversely, tires with very stiff construction can scream dump the pressure, at the first sign of anything bigger than a pebble, particularly on a firmly sprung heavy-duty pickup with no load.

Reinforcing Sidewall Lessons 

Another, older example are tests I conducted a few years ago, using two different sizes of the same tire, on two sets of Jeep Rubicon Moab wheels, on the same vehicle, with the same air pressure in both: Toyo Open Country MT LT265/75R16E vs. LT285/75R16E. Both tires have a 7-ply tread and 3-ply sidewall, are load-range E, have similar load capacities, and are very stiff designs. With 0.6″ additional lower sidewall, the taller 285s rode better on/off-road and flexed a little better when aired-down. This was experienced several times as both sets were in my fleet for a while and used on more than one 4WD. The stiff Toyo MT needs substantial deflation to obtain adequate deformation and ride quality off-highway, one of the tradeoffs for the Toyo’s very rugged design. The noticeable lack of flexibility from this otherwise excellent tire is a big negative for my all-around use. If you want a mud tire with less flex for very heavy hauling, or you don’t mind a firmer ride, the Toyo MT can be a great choice.

Flexibility and sidewall height, it matters.

Copyright © 2012 James Langan